Very well said, and so so true. These things all go together. We trauma bond with an abuser, we trauma bond with a cult or high-control church. Often times, those who grew up in abuse, but outside of the church (or other organized religion) are seeking the same high control person that they grew up with, and so they gravitate toward cultic churches. Likewise, those who grow up in cults end up with abusers.
This is groundbreaking and solidifies so many of the issues I've been wrestling with - from the bottom of my heart thank you. The isolation one feels for being the only one that see things this way (or the only one voicing it) in my community, a very "progressive" community even, the only one making appropriate boundaries, has been difficult. It leads to a certain kind of exhaustion that I am sure a lot of people here can relate to.
Men / women will agree with me intellectually, but not change...I don't want to cut people out but my strategy of being so emotionally invested in fighting these many injustices (that people do not want to change themselves) is also not working. Ultimately it is not my life and people are free to make their own choices. The most toxic people I have cut out (of course not without social repercussions because people don't understand exactly as you say in this article), but still need to interact with occasionally.
I am starting to feel like these confrontations, while not for nothing, are not the most high leverage strategy for change and living a joyful life...and in fact may leave me without the fuel necessary to create the bigger scale work I want to. When confronting men, and then additionally dealing with their indignant response and entitlement to my time that ensues, it actually feels like my time / energy is being further robbed than it already is by extractive patriarchy. Do you have advice for handing the isolation of this and channeling this desire for justice in ways that don't just leave me feeling depleted? Maybe I am doing too much explaining in these situations. Thank you.
Heading to court soon for temporary order of protection expiring-being told I cannot keep him from kids even if they don’t want to see him. The whole system is infuriating. I have heard the “try harder” advice my whole life. I finally divorced him. The abuse escalated. And you all know if I don’t follow the divorce decree and parenting plan to the letter, I will be in trouble. But apparently, he doesn’t have to.
"Marriage is hard and takes work" is just such a perfect lie fed to women to cover all manner of sins by men. "Unhappy in your marriage? Sorry, marriage takes work. What kind of entitled b*tch thinks it doesn't??" Meanwhile I have never heard a man being told marriage takes work. My husband was certainly not under that impression when we got married.
Can you write a book so I can have this information all available materially in my home? I can’t imagine losing these deep and thorough thought provoking works. This might be my favorite to date. Thank you thank you Zawn.
So well said! When I finally got out of my abusive marriage I read so many books and listened to so many podcasts about narcissists, healing from abuse, etc. It was overall eye opening and helpful. During that time I also found the Leah Remini series on Scientology and I was hooked! I couldn’t get enough learning about cults and especially stories of people leaving cults. First I thought it was just interesting reality type TV, but then I realized I felt so much solidarity with those people. As much as the therapy books helped, or tried to help, there was always this underlying feeling that (1) it was still my fault for allowing the abuse and (2) lots of focus on why the abuser was the way he was. With the people leaving cults the focus was more simply just getting out from an objectively bad situation. Now, I always recommend cult shows when I’m helping someone in the early stages of recognizing what’s happening.
That was one of my first real nuggets of truth I was able to digest from Zawn's writing - that it actually doesn't matter why my ex was the way he was. Saved me so much more of my energy and time, wrestling with why.
People hate the truth especially men but women, women are so rooted in delusions it’s definitely a continued case study. If I write this it’s going to read extreme. I always err on the side of extremity with words. Good thing is I’m not committing mass murder, wars, rapes or extreme carnage. Just writing but if you really and honestly think about it, and dove down that rabbit hole. Just say you thought without defense & defiance. Then you might come to fully realize and understand that from, womb to tomb men suck the life right out of women.
Related to this article and others: how does one make it more financially viable to get out and exist as a single mother? Our individual needs will vary of course. But as a society, if this is how men in a patriarchy operate, feeling entitled to women’s time and labor and leaving them penniless, and using the children to leverage more abuse, how does a woman combat that? Certainly not by jumping into another relationship with an exploitative man. What additional protections can be offered to women to keep them afloat?
We need to help each other. Normalize women living together and raising our children together.
I’m a world where we usually need multiple incomes and childcare to make it through each day, we can make life possible for each other if we women team up and do that life together.
Well someone wrote an article about me 😣
Very well said, and so so true. These things all go together. We trauma bond with an abuser, we trauma bond with a cult or high-control church. Often times, those who grew up in abuse, but outside of the church (or other organized religion) are seeking the same high control person that they grew up with, and so they gravitate toward cultic churches. Likewise, those who grow up in cults end up with abusers.
I know a woman who’s husband is very emotionally abusive and she’s also a Trump supporter. I saw the connection right away!
That's a fascinating connection to make.
This is groundbreaking and solidifies so many of the issues I've been wrestling with - from the bottom of my heart thank you. The isolation one feels for being the only one that see things this way (or the only one voicing it) in my community, a very "progressive" community even, the only one making appropriate boundaries, has been difficult. It leads to a certain kind of exhaustion that I am sure a lot of people here can relate to.
Men / women will agree with me intellectually, but not change...I don't want to cut people out but my strategy of being so emotionally invested in fighting these many injustices (that people do not want to change themselves) is also not working. Ultimately it is not my life and people are free to make their own choices. The most toxic people I have cut out (of course not without social repercussions because people don't understand exactly as you say in this article), but still need to interact with occasionally.
I am starting to feel like these confrontations, while not for nothing, are not the most high leverage strategy for change and living a joyful life...and in fact may leave me without the fuel necessary to create the bigger scale work I want to. When confronting men, and then additionally dealing with their indignant response and entitlement to my time that ensues, it actually feels like my time / energy is being further robbed than it already is by extractive patriarchy. Do you have advice for handing the isolation of this and channeling this desire for justice in ways that don't just leave me feeling depleted? Maybe I am doing too much explaining in these situations. Thank you.
Heading to court soon for temporary order of protection expiring-being told I cannot keep him from kids even if they don’t want to see him. The whole system is infuriating. I have heard the “try harder” advice my whole life. I finally divorced him. The abuse escalated. And you all know if I don’t follow the divorce decree and parenting plan to the letter, I will be in trouble. But apparently, he doesn’t have to.
Yes, I was constantly told "marriage is hard" and "you have to work at it" when I described my ex's behavior. Sorry you have to deal with this.
"Marriage is hard and takes work" is just such a perfect lie fed to women to cover all manner of sins by men. "Unhappy in your marriage? Sorry, marriage takes work. What kind of entitled b*tch thinks it doesn't??" Meanwhile I have never heard a man being told marriage takes work. My husband was certainly not under that impression when we got married.
Thank you for the laugh, whether you meant it to be funny or not. It's all so absurd.
Can you write a book so I can have this information all available materially in my home? I can’t imagine losing these deep and thorough thought provoking works. This might be my favorite to date. Thank you thank you Zawn.
So well said! When I finally got out of my abusive marriage I read so many books and listened to so many podcasts about narcissists, healing from abuse, etc. It was overall eye opening and helpful. During that time I also found the Leah Remini series on Scientology and I was hooked! I couldn’t get enough learning about cults and especially stories of people leaving cults. First I thought it was just interesting reality type TV, but then I realized I felt so much solidarity with those people. As much as the therapy books helped, or tried to help, there was always this underlying feeling that (1) it was still my fault for allowing the abuse and (2) lots of focus on why the abuser was the way he was. With the people leaving cults the focus was more simply just getting out from an objectively bad situation. Now, I always recommend cult shows when I’m helping someone in the early stages of recognizing what’s happening.
That was one of my first real nuggets of truth I was able to digest from Zawn's writing - that it actually doesn't matter why my ex was the way he was. Saved me so much more of my energy and time, wrestling with why.
Knitting Cult Lady on YouTube is a great channel to learn more about cults. https://youtu.be/P6CdoHCQoMA?si=zK3wvqjFtQk4lBXK
People hate the truth especially men but women, women are so rooted in delusions it’s definitely a continued case study. If I write this it’s going to read extreme. I always err on the side of extremity with words. Good thing is I’m not committing mass murder, wars, rapes or extreme carnage. Just writing but if you really and honestly think about it, and dove down that rabbit hole. Just say you thought without defense & defiance. Then you might come to fully realize and understand that from, womb to tomb men suck the life right out of women.
Related to this article and others: how does one make it more financially viable to get out and exist as a single mother? Our individual needs will vary of course. But as a society, if this is how men in a patriarchy operate, feeling entitled to women’s time and labor and leaving them penniless, and using the children to leverage more abuse, how does a woman combat that? Certainly not by jumping into another relationship with an exploitative man. What additional protections can be offered to women to keep them afloat?
We need to help each other. Normalize women living together and raising our children together.
I’m a world where we usually need multiple incomes and childcare to make it through each day, we can make life possible for each other if we women team up and do that life together.